Thank you, Sue, for the reminder about David Spangler -- which leaves me still wondering if, when, we will ever figure out how to quantify the unquantifiable value -- and values -- of love and kindness and empathy and caring within human nature today - more than ever for our Mother Nature, and her essential elements within and around us 🌎
We're on a precipice where we either get it or suffer unimaginable consequences. It obviously takes something as dire as our situation is now to get us to even possibly rescue ourselves. But crisis is opportunity, and, as MLK JR. famously said, “The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice,” so what is there but to be part of the positive and do a lot of praying?
I am so thrilled to see that you are sharing this excerpt from David Spangler's essay. In my experience, every communication from David is pure gold. I have been studying with him for almost 10 years, and his wisdom has been transformative for me, both supportive and empowering to my sense of engagement with my world. He has convinced me that we are never powerless, and that what may seem like a small, insignificant contribution to our world is often anything but. For more information about his work, I suggest people check out the Lorian Association at https://lorian.org/
and sign up for the newsletter. If you are curious to know more, you can sign up for one of their free webinars or take an introductory on-line class. I am eternally grateful to Lorian and the wonderful community of people that encompass it. It has fostered my joy, creativity, connection, and growth in so many ways.
Thank you for your wisdom and recommendations. I absolutely love the Wendell Berry quote: "We don't have the right to ask whether we're going to succeed or not. The only question we have a right to ask is what’s the right thing to do? What does this earth require of us if we want to continue to live."
This is kind of funny. I cut off the last few words of Wendell Berry because I thought, as a writer, he should have cut them, but you must have known the whole quote to put the words back in. I cut this: "if we want to continue to live."
How funny … I still screwed up. I had the quote in my database and rather than retype yours, I cut and pasted mine … and cut off the last two words. Sorry Wendell and Sue.
While I think the way you wrote it has more power, here’s the entire quote the way I think he wrote it … "We don't have the right to ask whether we're going to succeed or not. The only question we have a right to ask is what’s the right thing to do? What does this earth require of us if we want to continue to live on it?"
We are two peas in a pod, from way back. I don't know if this is the piece you meant, since they all would fit your description to one degree or another, but it's so good -- and I loved coming to this part in "Thoughts on the Current Moment": https://substack.com/@susanmeekerlowry/p-157482474
Excerpt:
I have found inspiration, meaning, and practical methods in various and sundry fields and thanks to many people who know way more about these things than I. One of these fields is cosmology, and the person I love the most (perhaps because I know him, but also because I resonate with his language and vision) is Brian Swimme. In his 1996 book, The Hidden Heart of the Cosmos, Humanity and the New Story, he wrote:
“The opportunity of our time is to integrate science’s understanding of the universe with more ancient intuitions concerning the meaning and destiny of the human. The promise of this work is that through such an enterprise the human species as a whole will begin to embrace a common meaning and a coherent program of action. . . . We are challenged here with understanding the significance of the human enterprise within an evolving universe. Upon our success in meeting this challenge rests the vitality of so much of the Earth Community, including the quality of life all future children will enjoy. . . . By learning the ways of the universe and by reflecting upon them as they surface in the daily life of family and work and community, we take the first steps into a new form of human understanding and existence.”
Thanks for your quote from David Spangler, your recommendations, and for keepin' on keepin' on! I am a big fan of Marianne Williamson, too. She's a serious leader for these times.
Hi folks. I tried posting much earlier, but there was an apparent glitch, (maybe Substack poster beginner's bad luck?) and it never re-appeared. Sure looked like it posted ok, at first. Gonna try again here with a quicker one, just to jump into the mix of this great discussion. Have to get my best friend to the hospital today, but will be back here for more.
In short, I praised our talented host; was inspired to subscribe to the two reporters she highlights; sentimentalized about Spangler, though my path differed greatly, but he's so right on with his more-than-a-metaphor about consciousness being tune-able kind of like a radio, a phenomenon which has changed my life since I also discovered it many decades ago.
Now in checking back since, I see this hot controversy which Janet surfaced and Suzanne replied to. A lot of the reason I wanted to jump in ASAP here is to say I hope Ms. Maker sticks around, here or elsewhere, to help sort this out. I really can't see a more important debate right now about "what's really going on" politically. (Is it obvious why?) I've been looking into this a lot, more and more, especially over the past month of course. That said, there's more to unpack on both sides, and maybe this isn't the most appropriate forum for it? If not, what is? Will of course defer to our fearless leader's preference.
I don't want to argue about Trump's transgressions, which are elsewhere everywhere. Let's deal here with what you won't find anywhere else, regarding how Trump could be what gets we-the-people to turn humanity around.
I truly believe that the greatest boon of a Trump presidency is the arousal of the opposition. Without the contrast he presents our motivation tends to wither and we become complacent. Just look around at the resistance he is engendering now.
“May it be on earth as it is in Heaven.” We have been praying for that for a long time. With this seemingly inexplicable turn of events could it be that we are getting even closer? Could it be that what some men mean for evil, God will use for good? I have come to believe this through these frightening early days of Trump's presidency.
After dwelling for awhile in helplessness, a miraculously answered sincere prayer for help on a personal issue reminded me of the power of prayer. For a small shy person like me it was a revelation that I could make a difference by using all the strength and sincerity of which I am capable in prayer. My small prayers may not reflect God's will, but in these times perhaps prayers can evolve to become part of a unified field. In the meantime, the sincere and power filled prayer of my heart is: May Your will be done - on earth as it is in Heaven.
I have a somewhat different point of view. While I do think Trump is moving the country in an anti-democratic direction, establishing rule by corrupt oligarchs, and I totally want him out of office and would never in a million years vote for him, it's also true that not everything he is doing is bad.
The Democratic party (like the Republican party) is rotten to the core and under the control of the Deep State, which is not any more democratic than Trump is. Trump is trying to dismantle the Deep State. He will probably fail like he did last time, but he has more tools now, and truthfully, the Deep State does deserve to be dismantled. For example USAID was basically a CIA front organization that operated secretly, unaccountable to elected officials. Maybe 10% of what it did was helpful, but the other 90% focused on things like regime change. Of course, Trump is also trying to dismantle good things like Social Security and Medicare, so he's not a good guy. Reality is not black and white.
Similarly, the corporate media has presented only one side of the Russian-Ukraine war, that completely obliterated the legitimate concerns of Russia. Imho, Biden/Harris was marching us toward nuclear war, and nothing Trump is doing concerning Ukraine could be worse than that.
Most Americans on the left believe what the corporate media like the NYT and CNN tells them, the same way that most of those on the right believe Fox News. Neither of them tells the truth unless the truth happens to be in the best interests of those who are paying them. Trump is no supporter of a free press, but he says he is going to allow some secrets to be revealed, such as information about the assassinations of JFK, RFK, and MLK, and data about UFOs. Maybe 911 too. That's a good thing if it's true.
So, in my view, Trump vs. the Democrats is not evil vs. good, but rather evil vs. lesser evil.
You are condoning pure evil. We don't have a political party that represents "us," the fair-minded people the Democrats also have sold out on by taking corporate money, but that's the only thing I agree with you on. It's why my Substack is all about what we-the-people can do that does an end-run around a government that doesn't serve us.
And it isn't that you have your opinions and I have mine and we'll have a polite debate, but that your positions are so misguided that my objective is to call that out -- without rancor toward you, whose heart is in the same place mine is, but your facts are in another universe.
Thank you, Sue, for the reminder about David Spangler -- which leaves me still wondering if, when, we will ever figure out how to quantify the unquantifiable value -- and values -- of love and kindness and empathy and caring within human nature today - more than ever for our Mother Nature, and her essential elements within and around us 🌎
We're on a precipice where we either get it or suffer unimaginable consequences. It obviously takes something as dire as our situation is now to get us to even possibly rescue ourselves. But crisis is opportunity, and, as MLK JR. famously said, “The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice,” so what is there but to be part of the positive and do a lot of praying?
Excellent idea to recommend posts! That’s an effective way of doing something.
I am so thrilled to see that you are sharing this excerpt from David Spangler's essay. In my experience, every communication from David is pure gold. I have been studying with him for almost 10 years, and his wisdom has been transformative for me, both supportive and empowering to my sense of engagement with my world. He has convinced me that we are never powerless, and that what may seem like a small, insignificant contribution to our world is often anything but. For more information about his work, I suggest people check out the Lorian Association at https://lorian.org/
and sign up for the newsletter. If you are curious to know more, you can sign up for one of their free webinars or take an introductory on-line class. I am eternally grateful to Lorian and the wonderful community of people that encompass it. It has fostered my joy, creativity, connection, and growth in so many ways.
You are so right. I give the link to read David's post that I took the excerpts from, that I urge everyone to read. He is a rare one.
This was the awesome communication he made about having cancer that I also urge everyone to read: https://lorian.org/community/2024/10/17/the-beauty-of-human-energy.
Thank you for your wisdom and recommendations. I absolutely love the Wendell Berry quote: "We don't have the right to ask whether we're going to succeed or not. The only question we have a right to ask is what’s the right thing to do? What does this earth require of us if we want to continue to live."
This is kind of funny. I cut off the last few words of Wendell Berry because I thought, as a writer, he should have cut them, but you must have known the whole quote to put the words back in. I cut this: "if we want to continue to live."
How funny … I still screwed up. I had the quote in my database and rather than retype yours, I cut and pasted mine … and cut off the last two words. Sorry Wendell and Sue.
While I think the way you wrote it has more power, here’s the entire quote the way I think he wrote it … "We don't have the right to ask whether we're going to succeed or not. The only question we have a right to ask is what’s the right thing to do? What does this earth require of us if we want to continue to live on it?"
I thought "if we wanted to live on it" was gratuitous. Of course we want to live on it. No? I bet if I said that to him, he would agree.
I’d agree with you.
I wrote a piece in my Substack a few days ago on a similar topic. David Spangler has been on my radar for decades.
We are two peas in a pod, from way back. I don't know if this is the piece you meant, since they all would fit your description to one degree or another, but it's so good -- and I loved coming to this part in "Thoughts on the Current Moment": https://substack.com/@susanmeekerlowry/p-157482474
Excerpt:
I have found inspiration, meaning, and practical methods in various and sundry fields and thanks to many people who know way more about these things than I. One of these fields is cosmology, and the person I love the most (perhaps because I know him, but also because I resonate with his language and vision) is Brian Swimme. In his 1996 book, The Hidden Heart of the Cosmos, Humanity and the New Story, he wrote:
“The opportunity of our time is to integrate science’s understanding of the universe with more ancient intuitions concerning the meaning and destiny of the human. The promise of this work is that through such an enterprise the human species as a whole will begin to embrace a common meaning and a coherent program of action. . . . We are challenged here with understanding the significance of the human enterprise within an evolving universe. Upon our success in meeting this challenge rests the vitality of so much of the Earth Community, including the quality of life all future children will enjoy. . . . By learning the ways of the universe and by reflecting upon them as they surface in the daily life of family and work and community, we take the first steps into a new form of human understanding and existence.”
Thanks for your quote from David Spangler, your recommendations, and for keepin' on keepin' on! I am a big fan of Marianne Williamson, too. She's a serious leader for these times.
Hi folks. I tried posting much earlier, but there was an apparent glitch, (maybe Substack poster beginner's bad luck?) and it never re-appeared. Sure looked like it posted ok, at first. Gonna try again here with a quicker one, just to jump into the mix of this great discussion. Have to get my best friend to the hospital today, but will be back here for more.
In short, I praised our talented host; was inspired to subscribe to the two reporters she highlights; sentimentalized about Spangler, though my path differed greatly, but he's so right on with his more-than-a-metaphor about consciousness being tune-able kind of like a radio, a phenomenon which has changed my life since I also discovered it many decades ago.
Now in checking back since, I see this hot controversy which Janet surfaced and Suzanne replied to. A lot of the reason I wanted to jump in ASAP here is to say I hope Ms. Maker sticks around, here or elsewhere, to help sort this out. I really can't see a more important debate right now about "what's really going on" politically. (Is it obvious why?) I've been looking into this a lot, more and more, especially over the past month of course. That said, there's more to unpack on both sides, and maybe this isn't the most appropriate forum for it? If not, what is? Will of course defer to our fearless leader's preference.
I don't want to argue about Trump's transgressions, which are elsewhere everywhere. Let's deal here with what you won't find anywhere else, regarding how Trump could be what gets we-the-people to turn humanity around.
I truly believe that the greatest boon of a Trump presidency is the arousal of the opposition. Without the contrast he presents our motivation tends to wither and we become complacent. Just look around at the resistance he is engendering now.
“May it be on earth as it is in Heaven.” We have been praying for that for a long time. With this seemingly inexplicable turn of events could it be that we are getting even closer? Could it be that what some men mean for evil, God will use for good? I have come to believe this through these frightening early days of Trump's presidency.
After dwelling for awhile in helplessness, a miraculously answered sincere prayer for help on a personal issue reminded me of the power of prayer. For a small shy person like me it was a revelation that I could make a difference by using all the strength and sincerity of which I am capable in prayer. My small prayers may not reflect God's will, but in these times perhaps prayers can evolve to become part of a unified field. In the meantime, the sincere and power filled prayer of my heart is: May Your will be done - on earth as it is in Heaven.
I have a somewhat different point of view. While I do think Trump is moving the country in an anti-democratic direction, establishing rule by corrupt oligarchs, and I totally want him out of office and would never in a million years vote for him, it's also true that not everything he is doing is bad.
The Democratic party (like the Republican party) is rotten to the core and under the control of the Deep State, which is not any more democratic than Trump is. Trump is trying to dismantle the Deep State. He will probably fail like he did last time, but he has more tools now, and truthfully, the Deep State does deserve to be dismantled. For example USAID was basically a CIA front organization that operated secretly, unaccountable to elected officials. Maybe 10% of what it did was helpful, but the other 90% focused on things like regime change. Of course, Trump is also trying to dismantle good things like Social Security and Medicare, so he's not a good guy. Reality is not black and white.
Similarly, the corporate media has presented only one side of the Russian-Ukraine war, that completely obliterated the legitimate concerns of Russia. Imho, Biden/Harris was marching us toward nuclear war, and nothing Trump is doing concerning Ukraine could be worse than that.
Most Americans on the left believe what the corporate media like the NYT and CNN tells them, the same way that most of those on the right believe Fox News. Neither of them tells the truth unless the truth happens to be in the best interests of those who are paying them. Trump is no supporter of a free press, but he says he is going to allow some secrets to be revealed, such as information about the assassinations of JFK, RFK, and MLK, and data about UFOs. Maybe 911 too. That's a good thing if it's true.
So, in my view, Trump vs. the Democrats is not evil vs. good, but rather evil vs. lesser evil.
You are condoning pure evil. We don't have a political party that represents "us," the fair-minded people the Democrats also have sold out on by taking corporate money, but that's the only thing I agree with you on. It's why my Substack is all about what we-the-people can do that does an end-run around a government that doesn't serve us.
And it isn't that you have your opinions and I have mine and we'll have a polite debate, but that your positions are so misguided that my objective is to call that out -- without rancor toward you, whose heart is in the same place mine is, but your facts are in another universe.